bannednutritionnapsgear

My Test experience, help urgently needed

carsbigs

New member
Member
Hi Dylan,

I just wanted to thank you first of all for the great content you are putting online every day! This is clearly made with much passion and dedication, which is really felt and much appreciated!

That being said, I have a problem and really hope you can help me out with this.

I'm 33 years old, 185 cm and actually 95 Kg and about 18% BF. I've been training for the past 4 years. Last year I had a surgery to my right knee so I could not work out for about 6 months, that’s why my BF went up. I was at about 11% BF before surgery.

Last December I decided to start my first Test E cycle and was expecting some strength gain/increase. (Actually, I weighed 90 kg when I started the cycle and about 17% BF). My plan was to put on some muscles and at the same time burn BF to achieve my 11% or do even better than that. Unfortunately, what happened was the opposite! I started to feel very weak and lethargic and at some point (30-60min after injecting) I had some flu-like symptoms and a light fever started to develop, which manifested 6-8 hrs after injecting and lasted for about 2 to 4 hrs. I was also very bloated and started to gain water weight like crazy. After one week on Test E I gained about 6 kg! I know for sure this were not muscles, but the major part of it water, because I could literally feel it in my fingers and feet (horrible feeling). My RHR was about 85 bpm and I felt like shit! Obviously, I was no more able to train normally for a couple of days.

Now, being new to this stuff I didn’t know how to react or what to do. My buddy didn’t know what to do either because this shit was something he never experienced before. So, I decided to switch over to Test P (250mg/Week, Injecting 2x per Week 125 mg). Thanks to the shorter ester, I finally got rid of the extreme water retention and could train again having less fever-like symptoms. Although the PIP was even greater with Test P, I kept on training and injecting for 6 Weeks hoping I would benefit at some point of all the known benefits Test should bring… But no strength increase occurred, I felt weak and lethargic more and more. At this point I switched Test brand thinking it was maybe the oil..The symptoms were not that bad anymore with the new brand, I still did hold water and my RHR was pretty high, but I didn’t get the fever and the PIP was bearable.

BUT at some point (after week 6) I had to get up at night, every night about 4-5 times to urinate. Then I started to worry something could be wrong with my prostate.I didn't have any sort of strenght increase either. So, after 7 weeks in, I decided to quit the cycle.
Now, I didn’t use any AI because the dosage of Test I was running is considered to be very low. But listening to you videos I think this were some estrogen related symptoms I was experiencing, probably due to strong aromatization of test. Although I’m not an expert by any means, I’m pretty sure of that. I didn’t experience any Gyno symptoms though. Now thank God I did some blood work before AND after the cycle. Of course, my blood work was very good before and my T-Levels normal (I was on the higher side actually). After the cycle everything was in a normal range except for the Testosterone (obviously) and the Estradiol level: Testosterone 49.7 mmol/L / Estradiol 0.19 mmol/L / Free Test 128.4 pmol/L.

I went to see a doctor which is known for being an expert in this field having 25 years of experience and he himself uses performance enhancement drugs. He told me, my receptors were not able to pick up the stuff correctly and pass it over to the organs that needed it, that’s why I was having this strange reaction because too much test was circulating in the blood and the body didn’t know how to use it properly, whatever...

To be honest, I personally don’t believe that because Test is not a foreign substance to the body, even if introduced endogenously. That’s why I’m asking you for an opinion. I’m not expecting a “remote-diagnosis” by any means, but if you could give me your honest opinion or any suggestion, that would be of great help to me and much much appreciated, since I value your opinion very highly!

I’m planning to start my second cycle and add some Aromasin to it, just to see how things go. If this cycle goes well and PCT is completed successfully (Clomid and Tamoxifen) I would love to stack some Test with T-Bol or Primo.

Now this doc told me to start my next cycle with an oral only like t-bol or winstrol or even an injectable like Primo only to see how things go. Since I heard you and I know how you think about running stuff without test, I’m not willing to do that. Given the particular circumstances I could try but…I don’t really feel good about it. I don’t want any suppressions symptoms to occur, I already had a bad experience just with Test and I would like to avoid having a bad one again at all costs!


Any thought/suggestion/help from THE expert would be much appreciated!
 

Lordfinesse

Member
Member
NEVVVVEERRRRRRRRR run a oral only cycle!!!!! That's one of the worst things you can do in life! I'll rather fight a pitbull blindfolded than to run a oral only mate.
 

DylanGemelli

Founding Member
Super Moderator
your body fat is too high to be using any sort of steroid right now bro, i could not recommend that... you need to get it back down in the 12-13 range first
 

cbbram

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
Thanks for giving us a perfect example on why you shouldn't run a cycle with high bf%.

BF% should be below 15%... 12-13% preferred.

What a mess this cycle was... I think you made just about every mistake possible. Please educate yourself on the forum before proceeding on another cycle.
 
Last edited:

Dangans

Active member
Member
NEVVVVEERRRRRRRRR run a oral only cycle!!!!! That's one of the worst things you can do in life! I'll rather fight a pitbull blindfolded than to run a oral only mate.

Lord Finesse is one of my favorite rappers.


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Dangans

Active member
Member
Thanks for giving us a perfect example on why you shouldn't run a cycle with high bf%.

BF% should be below 15%... 12-13% preferred.

What a mess this cycle was... I think you made just about every mistake possible. Please educate yourself on the forum before proceeding on another cycle.

I agree to a certain extent about high BF an aas the issues is blood pressure high RBC high hematocrit and Hemoglobin. But as being higher body coverts higher estrogen is not true. If no one believes me go watch this https://youtu.be/PY2NBkHTZvY


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DylanGemelli

Founding Member
Super Moderator
I agree to a certain extent about high BF an aas the issues is blood pressure high RBC high hematocrit and Hemoglobin. But as being higher body coverts higher estrogen is not true. If no one believes me go watch this https://youtu.be/PY2NBkHTZvY


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you know i love you but thats completely false bro... i dont have time to watch 38 minutes worth of video but i guess i'll sit here and link as much as i can not to mention this is one of the basic things ive learned many many many years ago and have discussed with so many doctors about estrogen and fat... estrogen dominance is caused by many things and one of them is DIRECTLY related to having a higher body fat... its a known fact in the medical field...

https://drjockers.com/estrogen-dominance/

https://www.worldhealth.net/news/estrogen-dominance-men-ruining-your-health-/

https://universityhealthnews.com/daily/nutrition/8-surprising-high-estrogen-symptoms-in-men/

https://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/planet32.htm

https://www.pcrm.org/health/cancer-resources/diet-cancer/nutrition/fat-and-hormonal-effects

https://academic.oup.com/jnci/article/91/6/529/2549361



i can go on and on... high fat diets can cause rises in estrogen as well.. studies show it... trust me, i am beyond 1 million percent certain that a higher body fat translates into a higher rate of estrogen conversion
 

Dangans

Active member
Member
you know i love you but thats completely false bro... i dont have time to watch 38 minutes worth of video but i guess i'll sit here and link as much as i can not to mention this is one of the basic things ive learned many many many years ago and have discussed with so many doctors about estrogen and fat... estrogen dominance is caused by many things and one of them is DIRECTLY related to having a higher body fat... its a known fact in the medical field...

https://drjockers.com/estrogen-dominance/

https://www.worldhealth.net/news/estrogen-dominance-men-ruining-your-health-/

https://universityhealthnews.com/daily/nutrition/8-surprising-high-estrogen-symptoms-in-men/

https://www.bodybuilding.com/fun/planet32.htm

https://www.pcrm.org/health/cancer-resources/diet-cancer/nutrition/fat-and-hormonal-effects

https://academic.oup.com/jnci/article/91/6/529/2549361



i can go on and on... high fat diets can cause rises in estrogen as well.. studies show it... trust me, i am beyond 1 million percent certain that a higher body fat translates into a higher rate of estrogen conversion

All love brother friends don’t have to agree with everything. Lol


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DylanGemelli

Founding Member
Super Moderator
All love brother friends don’t have to agree with everything. Lol


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lol no i agree... if you show me two people that agree on everything i'll show you two liars.. LOL just wanted to be very respectful to you about it brother
 

Dangans

Active member
Member
I guess I’m one lucky SOB because when I was 30% body fat my estro was only 13


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DylanGemelli

Founding Member
Super Moderator
I guess I’m one lucky SOB because when I was 30% body fat my estro was only 13


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well of course every single person wont have the same experience and some people just dont get estrogen for whatever reason but GENERALLY and more often than that, thats what happens... there is a far far far higher rate of estrogen conversion... thats clinical based, not my info... but fuck, some people cannot eat one carb without gaining weight, then you see someone like my wife who can eat fucking rice 100 times a day and still weight 99 lbs..
 

Dangans

Active member
Member
well of course every single person wont have the same experience and some people just dont get estrogen for whatever reason but GENERALLY and more often than that, thats what happens... there is a far far far higher rate of estrogen conversion... thats clinical based, not my info... but fuck, some people cannot eat one carb without gaining weight, then you see someone like my wife who can eat fucking rice 100 times a day and still weight 99 lbs..

This is true it’s all about person to person


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carsbigs

New member
Member
Thank you guys for your help so far.

Thanks for giving us a perfect example on why you shouldn't run a cycle with high bf%.

BF% should be below 15%... 12-13% preferred.

What a mess this cycle was... I think you made just about every mistake possible. Please educate yourself on the forum before proceeding on another cycle.

It would be really helpful for me to know, what are the mistakes I actually did in your opinion, besides having started a cycle at a higher BF%.
 

cbbram

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
Thank you guys for your help so far.



It would be really helpful for me to know, what are the mistakes I actually did in your opinion, besides having started a cycle at a higher BF%.
Fair enough... Just off the top of my head so I don't have to read your original post again was not running an AI. High bf% with an AI is bad enough but with no AI at that bf% is reckless and dangerous and that's why you had a lot of those problems.
 

NJBro

Senior Member
Fair enough... Just off the top of my head so I don't have to read your original post again was not running an AI. High bf% with an AI is bad enough but with no AI at that bf% is reckless and dangerous and that's why you had a lot of those problems.

Cbbram is 100% correct.

I am on TRT (200mg a week) and started when my BF was 30%. I ran an AI (Emexastane) @ 12.5 eod while eating and exercising to cut fat. I am down to around 15% now. I am not using an AI now as I Am running my TRT at a maintenance level (100mg a week) and my bloods are all in the normal range. Just to be clear I’m prescribed 200mg a week but I Have cut it to 100 on my own.

I will begin to cut fat so that I can run a cycle in April. The one thing I Will do before starting my cycle is run an AI at 7mg eod without raising my T dose. And eat/exercise to cut down my BF. I feel like it helps me to cut fat easier when my estrogen levels are pushed down a bit.
 

DylanGemelli

Founding Member
Super Moderator
Cbbram is 100% correct.

I am on TRT (200mg a week) and started when my BF was 30%. I ran an AI (Emexastane) @ 12.5 eod while eating and exercising to cut fat. I am down to around 15% now. I am not using an AI now as I Am running my TRT at a maintenance level (100mg a week) and my bloods are all in the normal range. Just to be clear I’m prescribed 200mg a week but I Have cut it to 100 on my own.

I will begin to cut fat so that I can run a cycle in April. The one thing I Will do before starting my cycle is run an AI at 7mg eod without raising my T dose. And eat/exercise to cut down my BF. I feel like it helps me to cut fat easier when my estrogen levels are pushed down a bit.
thanks for sharing brother... first hand experience is always extremely beneficial...
 

cbbram

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
Cbbram is 100% correct.

I am on TRT (200mg a week) and started when my BF was 30%. I ran an AI (Emexastane) @ 12.5 eod while eating and exercising to cut fat. I am down to around 15% now. I am not using an AI now as I Am running my TRT at a maintenance level (100mg a week) and my bloods are all in the normal range. Just to be clear I’m prescribed 200mg a week but I Have cut it to 100 on my own.

I will begin to cut fat so that I can run a cycle in April. The one thing I Will do before starting my cycle is run an AI at 7mg eod without raising my T dose. And eat/exercise to cut down my BF. I feel like it helps me to cut fat easier when my estrogen levels are pushed down a bit.
Congrats on your progress... Thanks for sharing.
 
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