Off cycle

[Gixxer]

Hey guys, I had a question about post cycle.
I was running Test/Deca 500/350mg a week for 16 weeks , I got great results with adding 20lbs of muscle and maintaining my BF at 11%
I'm on TRT so after cycle I just started my TRT again. I've been off cycle for 4 weeks and every month I do a Bod Pod that measures my weight, muscle mass and body fat %... I lost 8lbs of muscle and gain 2% BF.

My question is, do you think I really lost muscle? The reason I ask is because I know Deca makes you hold water and I was a bit bloated on cycle and was wondering if maybe with me holding water may have messed with the results. Since off cycle I'm definitely not bloated anymore and feel great.

I know coming off cycle you are likely to lose some muscle but it's only been 4 weeks and my strength really hasn't dropped at the gym. The only thing that went down was my squats. Just concerned about losing almost half my gains in 4 weeks.

Appreciate the feedback!

 

[Godlikebeast]

Generally speaking if on trt you dont need PCT, Beacuse you are getting your test at a normal levels, but has to be timed correctly and have bloods monitored. But make sure to be taking AI.

Also does not mean your not going to loose any gains just beacuse on trt. But if maintaining your consistency with diet and training, the greater of keeping and maintaining your gains.

Are you self prescribing trt or is it by doc?




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[Gixxer]

It's prescribed by my doctor. But I'm doing a bit more then he prescribed because my levels were 850 on 140mg weekly.
I'm doing 200mg weekly and that puts me just over 1000, which I'm happy. And yes I'm prescribed Arimidex for my TRT dose.

It's just concerning to drop that much muscle so quickly after coming off cycle. Wanted to know if that's normal or what others have experienced when coming off cycle and going back to TRT.

 

[RickRock]

When you come off your glycogen storage within the muscles will return to normal p, and hence your muscles wil not hold as much water. You likely did lose several pounds of water, and Thea out delends on the compounds used and how much you were retaining. If you are dry enough it might be 2 lbs, but if you are more on the wet side it could be more than 5 lbs and up to 10. It's impossible to say exactly how much you lost, but those bodpod numbers are a bit skewed because it will read a loss of muscle mass when it's just water and glycogen returning to normal which inflates and increases muscle volume, since that is what muscle is comprised of, even if there was no tissue loss.

 

[DylanGemelli]

actually, deca does not hold water whatsoever if you run it properly.. thats one of the MANY misconceptions out there that is so far off base... people that have water issues with deca do not run it properly by either running it too high AND/OR not running the proper ancillaries... even on trt you need to control cortisol to a point as well which can destroy your gains... people also fall off in terms of diet and training after cycles as well... there are NUMEROUS possibilities that could have occurred here

 

[Gixxer]

Being 120% honest, has your diet or training fluctuated at all since coming off cycle?
That seems like a lot of bad weight to gain and a lot of muscle to lose in just 1 month.

8lbs of muscle? 8lbs of muscle? No way you lost that much, its more likely that if your weight has dropped that much... You have probably lost some water and glycogen stores within the muscle, but not actual tissue itself. 2% body fat is a huge amount to gain in just 4 weeks as well?

What does the mirror say? Do you look that much fatter and like you have deflated a ton? You said strength was pretty similar, so its likely you may have lost a bit of muscle but I doubt its to the extreme that the test is indicating.

Well my diet changed from bulk to cut. When I was bulking I consumed 4,500/4,700cals 300g protein 550/600 carbs and 120fats. I ended my cycle then two weeks later started my cut, which I've been cutting for two weeks now. 3750cals 300 protein 450 carbs 80 fats. Yes the mirror does show some fat, not so much deflated. Towards the end of my cycle I had the issue with my e2 sky rocketing because of bad aromasin so I was bloated and very wet. Now I'm back to normal with less water retention. 2% BF in 4 weeks seems like a lot to me as well but like I mentioned before I've only been on cut for two prior to the bodpod measurement.

When you come off your glycogen storage within the muscles will return to normal p, and hence your muscles wil not hold as much water. You likely did lose several pounds of water, and Thea out delends on the compounds used and how much you were retaining. If you are dry enough it might be 2 lbs, but if you are more on the wet side it could be more than 5 lbs and up to 10. It's impossible to say exactly how much you lost, but those bodpod numbers are a bit skewed because it will read a loss of muscle mass when it's just water and glycogen returning to normal which inflates and increases muscle volume, since that is what muscle is comprised of, even if there was no tissue loss.

I definitely felt "full" when on cycle. My shirts had a nice tightness to them around the sleeves. Same with my quads in jeans, felt full and thick. I know I held water throughout my cycle, because my face was a bit puffy.
I was running Test C/Deca 500/350mg aromasin 12.5mg every other day. You guys helped me put together that cycle.
Next cycle I need to increase my aromasin to daily because I'm sensitive to e2 conversation.

actually, deca does not hold water whatsoever if you run it properly.. thats one of the MANY misconceptions out there that is so far off base... people that have water issues with deca do not run it properly by either running it too high AND/OR not running the proper ancillaries... even on trt you need to control cortisol to a point as well which can destroy your gains... people also fall off in terms of diet and training after cycles as well... there are NUMEROUS possibilities that could have occurred here

How do I control my cortisol? .... I definitely need to tighten up my diet and "go hard" on my training. I will run Test C/Deca again for my second cycle, hopefully this time I can stay more dry with proper dosing and AI.

 

[DylanGemelli]

Well my diet changed from bulk to cut. When I was bulking I consumed 4,500/4,700cals 300g protein 550/600 carbs and 120fats. I ended my cycle then two weeks later started my cut, which I've been cutting for two weeks now. 3750cals 300 protein 450 carbs 80 fats. Yes the mirror does show some fat, not so much deflated. Towards the end of my cycle I had the issue with my e2 sky rocketing because of bad aromasin so I was bloated and very wet. Now I'm back to normal with less water retention. 2% BF in 4 weeks seems like a lot to me as well but like I mentioned before I've only been on cut for two prior to the bodpod measurement.




I definitely felt "full" when on cycle. My shirts had a nice tightness to them around the sleeves. Same with my quads in jeans, felt full and thick. I know I held water throughout my cycle, because my face was a bit puffy.
I was running Test C/Deca 500/350mg aromasin 12.5mg every other day. You guys helped me put together that cycle.
Next cycle I need to increase my aromasin to daily because I'm sensitive to e2 conversation.




How do I control my cortisol? .... I definitely need to tighten up my diet and "go hard" on my training. I will run Test C/Deca again for my second cycle, hopefully this time I can stay more dry with proper dosing and AI.

two things help control cortisol extremely well... GW501516 and MK2866... both not only control it but keep your gains clean and also can add to them... its IMPERATIVE to have your AI and Prolactin protection dosing dialed in as well... also, its equally important to run the proper doses of test and deca

 

[DylanGemelli]

when you are in pct, you are going to get a major spike in cortisol... cortisol is termed the "gains killer" for a reason... it will put you into a catabolic state which will not allow you to build muscle and at the same time will eat it away, on top of the fact you will also get unwanted fat gain... so you will lose muscle and gain fat that you had just busted your ass an entire cycle for... GW and MK prevent the rise in cortisol... not only that but they keep you performing at a level you were while on cycle being the ultimate performance enhancers they are... on top of the fact that mk2866 is the ultimate for healing and recovery, which is imperative in pct as well as keeping strength up to a very high level... gw will also treat cholesterol and blood pressure, which are definitely things that need addressed in pct as well…








here is the link to purchase the entire pct stack followed by the layout...




https://www.sarmsx.com/index.php?rou...earch=platinum




clomid 50/50/25/25
nolva 40/20/20/20
aromasin 12.5 mg eod
mk-2866 25 mg day
gw-501516 20 mg day

 

[Gixxer]

two things help control cortisol extremely well... GW501516 and MK2866... both not only control it but keep your gains clean and also can add to them... its IMPERATIVE to have your AI and Prolactin protection dosing dialed in as well... also, its equally important to run the proper doses of test and deca

Thanks Dylan.. I'll have to look into getting those for my next cycle.

My AI and prolactin were on point until the last month on cycle when I got bunk AI, also I was running your recommendation on Test/Deca dose. I am planning on doing the exact cycle for my second cycle. But this time I know I need more AI to control my conversation rate to estrogen. I really enjoyed running Test/Deca for my first cycle.

 

[Gixxer]

When you end a cycle you never want to be in a caloric deficit. That is the time to implement maintenance based strength training at higher intensity and lower volume and to keep a maintenance level of calories for about a month or so. Used in conjunction with GW and mk2866 you basically counter the cortisol, along with any loss of tissue gained. By lowering your overall volume of work from hypertrophy and overload to maintenance allows your joints and ligaments a chance to heal from the pounding your increased strength and endurance just gave them, while maintaining all your current gains.

These factors along with your estrogen spike caused some of the change, however I wouldn't fully rely on the bod pod. The mirror imo is a better indicator of progress than anything. It's cool you get to use that thing so often though. Just know ultimately your "loss" of gains is not quite as dramatic as the numbers show.


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When I came off cycle I was still eating 4,500 calories, but after two weeks I switched to "cut" and dropped to 3700 calories which is above my maintenance, so technically I'm not in a calorie deficit just yet. Just like before when I cut, I slowly reduce my calories from over maintenance to maintenance then calorie deficit. I never dramatically drop my calories all at once. But that's good to know and I will try your suggestion about calories/training to keep my gains.

The bodpod is just a reference point, but I definitely go off look and feel more than the bodpod results.

 

[DylanGemelli]

Thanks Dylan.. I'll have to look into getting those for my next cycle.

My AI and prolactin were on point until the last month on cycle when I got bunk AI, also I was running your recommendation on Test/Deca dose. I am planning on doing the exact cycle for my second cycle. But this time I know I need more AI to control my conversation rate to estrogen. I really enjoyed running Test/Deca for my first cycle.

get yourself real quality aromasin... here is the link... i GUARANTEE you that this is as strong as you will find... https://www.sarmsx.com/liquiaro-15mgs-ml-30mls