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MYOSTATIN- The gains killer

RickRock

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
A topic I wanted to start some discussion on, is that of Myostatin, and it's role in limiting and even halting gains made on cycle when levels of myostatin reaches high levels in the body.

It's pretty common knowledge that during a cycle, you won't just keep gaining and gaining forever. At some point, your gains will stall out completely despite running the same doses. Myostatin is an unavoidable reality. It is going to happen. For most people, this seems to happen around the 8 week (day 56) mark of a cycle. There are other things that can impact this, like the compounds and doses used. For example, running a heavy cycle with multiple short/no ester compounds at higher doses will raise myostatin much quicker than a lower dosed one or two mild compound cycle with longer esters. However, no matter what myostatin will eventually take over in both cases at some point and stall your gains.

So, what can you do about it to make the most of your cycle? There are myostatin reducers and inhibitors out there, but NONE of them have ever been shown to do anything except empty your wallet unfortunately. Luckily, there are a few tricks to enable you to get a little more out of everything.


Tapering Doses up: if you start at a certain dose and raise the dose slightly every couple weeks or so, this can help overcome myostatin from stalling you out by raising the dose just enough to continue some gains. It won't be a substantial amount, but enough to still make progress. Another tactic is to just increase the dose at or near the 8 week mark just before the gains start to diminish

Adding in a more anabolic compound is another option. For example, someone running a test cycle with EQ might decide at the 8 week mark to add in Tren Ace for this reason. The powerful nature of Tren could continue the gains for a bit longer until myostatin wins once again. Orals could work in this instance as well, but the basic idea is to add in something powerful just before your gains stall.


To lower myostatin, basically you need to lower your doses, come off, or cruise for long enough for it to baseline to normal levels. The amount of time this takes depends on a few things but a good general rule of thumb is to take a good 10-12 weeks cruising or off cycle after being on high levels in order to bring your myostatin down enough to get the most out of your next cycle. If you don't take enough time off before going on high doses, your myostatin will peak out even quicker, and your gains will be much less than what you could have gained.

This is a very interesting and debatable topic, that I love to research and find out what I can on the topic. Please feel free to discuss and share your own views on the subject!
 

DylanGemelli

Founding Member
Super Moderator
RickRock said:
A topic I wanted to start some discussion on, is that of Myostatin, and it's role in limiting and even halting gains made on cycle when levels of myostatin reaches high levels in the body.

It's pretty common knowledge that during a cycle, you won't just keep gaining and gaining forever. At some point, your gains will stall out completely despite running the same doses. Myostatin is an unavoidable reality. It is going to happen. For most people, this seems to happen around the 8 week (day 56) mark of a cycle. There are other things that can impact this, like the compounds and doses used. For example, running a heavy cycle with multiple short/no ester compounds at higher doses will raise myostatin much quicker than a lower dosed one or two mild compound cycle with longer esters. However, no matter what myostatin will eventually take over in both cases at some point and stall your gains.

So, what can you do about it to make the most of your cycle? There are myostatin reducers and inhibitors out there, but NONE of them have ever been shown to do anything except empty your wallet unfortunately. Luckily, there are a few tricks to enable you to get a little more out of everything.


Tapering Doses up: if you start at a certain dose and raise the dose slightly every couple weeks or so, this can help overcome myostatin from stalling you out by raising the dose just enough to continue some gains. It won't be a substantial amount, but enough to still make progress. Another tactic is to just increase the dose at or near the 8 week mark just before the gains start to diminish

Adding in a more anabolic compound is another option. For example, someone running a test cycle with EQ might decide at the 8 week mark to add in Tren Ace for this reason. The powerful nature of Tren could continue the gains for a bit longer until myostatin wins once again. Orals could work in this instance as well, but the basic idea is to add in something powerful just before your gains stall.


To lower myostatin, basically you need to lower your doses, come off, or cruise for long enough for it to baseline to normal levels. The amount of time this takes depends on a few things but a good general rule of thumb is to take a good 10-12 weeks cruising or off cycle after being on high levels in order to bring your myostatin down enough to get the most out of your next cycle. If you don't take enough time off before going on high doses, your myostatin will peak out even quicker, and your gains will be much less than what you could have gained.

This is a very interesting and debatable topic, that I love to research and find out what I can on the topic. Please feel free to discuss and share your own views on the subject!

Guys, Rick is EXTREMELY well versed on this topic and this is something very real and very misunderstood... It is quite a difficult concept and that's apparent as there are so many different outlooks, reactions and understanding involved but if there is anyone you can go to to really grasp this concept, it's Rick. Our good friend LedHead has a deep understanding on this and he helped shed a lot of light to myself, Rick and several others and I watched Rick get extremely intricate in his study of this and his understanding... You need to take advantage of having his knowledge on this and go to him with any questions... He is the best versed on this topic that I know... I cannot think of anyone better to go to on this and this is VERY real and it explains quite a bit for many who wonder why things tend to stall out or peaks get reached rapidly... Thank you for this post Rick, it really sheds a lot of light for everyone...
 

cybrsage

Member
Great info, and it explains why I have started to plateau even though I am increasing my calories during my bulk. I am about two weeks out from the end of my bulk cycle. This seems to be the exact culprit.

Great info, as always!!
 

RickRock

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
cybrsage said:
Great info, and it explains why I have started to plateau even though I am increasing my calories during my bulk. I am about two weeks out from the end of my bulk cycle. This seems to be the exact culprit.

Great info, as always!!


You are exactly right my friend. You arent doing anything wrong at all. Its must that eventually myostatin wins out, no matter how much you raise your calories. Actually raising calories more at that point would only be detrimental because obviously muscle gain is impossible at that point. All excess would only be stored as bodyfat. That also brings me to my next point...

Using mysotatin to your advantage with a longer cycle! Basically you would break down a cycle into two phases. A bulking phase followed by a cutting phase. This ends up being a recomp by the time the cycle is done. Ive done this numerous times myself and it works beautifully. Ima fan of longer cycles. Mine are typically anywhere from 12-16 weeks in length. For the first 6-8 weeks of a cycle i really push the calories higher and concentrate on packing on the LBM. Once myostatin peaks out around the 8 week mark, i switch over to a cut since muscle gain has been compromised. At this point, the high levels of androgens are there to spare muscle mass while i use the next 6-8 weeks to strip the bodyfat leaving every ounce of muscle I built left with a very nice shredded outcome at the end. To me its the holy grail of cycling, and thats how you take the "glass half full" approach to myostatin levels peaked out without just coming off or cruising.
 

cybrsage

Member
I am wondering if the TNE I just started taking a few times a week will push me past the myostatin barrier again, if only for a little bit. That is all I really need anyway, another two weeks or so and the bulk is over.

As a note, it was around the eight week mark I saw the gains dwindle down. My STRENGTH keeps increasing, but muscle size is not...I know the strength is increasing because the weight I am moving is still going up. I just looked at it as "well, no more size, but strength is just as important, if not more so. :)

I like the cut immediately idea - the high levels of androgens will certainly be put to good use!
 
P

PHURIOUS

Guest
Re: RE: Re: MYOSTATIN- The gains killer

cybrsage said:
I am wondering if the TNE I just started taking a few times a week will push me past the myostatin barrier again, if only for a little bit. That is all I really need anyway, another two weeks or so and the bulk is over.

As a note, it was around the eight week mark I saw the gains dwindle down. My STRENGTH keeps increasing, but muscle size is not...I know the strength is increasing because the weight I am moving is still going up. I just looked at it as "well, no more size, but strength is just as important, if not more so. :)

I like the cut immediately idea - the high levels of androgens will certainly be put to good use!
It will but watch the estrogen levels. Tne is known for that. Keep an eye on it
 

scurry30

Member
This is an awesome thread bro. Very informative. This is the type of info this board needs to grow and Excel. I appreciate the research and time you obviously spent on this.
 

RickRock

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
cybrsage said:
I am wondering if the TNE I just started taking a few times a week will push me past the myostatin barrier again, if only for a little bit. That is all I really need anyway, another two weeks or so and the bulk is over.

As a note, it was around the eight week mark I saw the gains dwindle down. My STRENGTH keeps increasing, but muscle size is not...I know the strength is increasing because the weight I am moving is still going up. I just looked at it as "well, no more size, but strength is just as important, if not more so. :)

I like the cut immediately idea - the high levels of androgens will certainly be put to good use!

The TNE you out to use will be fast acting just like an oral, and is very anabolic, so yes it can help you continue gains a little further. It is true tht it will be short lived, but you have the right idea. Adding in something around that time to increase muscle mass is a very good idea.

Also as you noted, just because muscle gain stops, does not mean gaining strength he to stop. You can still make some excellent progress on increasing weight or reps on lifts, despite myostatin being peaked. Strength gains will probably be slow, but progress can still be had there absolutely.
 

RickRock

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
scurry30 said:
This is an awesome thread bro. Very informative. This is the type of info this board needs to grow and Excel. I appreciate the research and time you obviously spent on this.


Thank you very much brother! I appreciate it! Any questions or any discussion you may have, feel free to post it up. I'm also available to help anyone anytime. Just send me a PM for anything at all.
 

RickRock

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
There's been some recent discussion relating to this topic, so I thought I'd bump this again for anyone that may have not seen it


(PM me for a price list for Biotech Labs and 10% discount)
 

DylanGemelli

Founding Member
Super Moderator
There's been some recent discussion relating to this topic, so I thought I'd bump this again for anyone that may have not seen it


(PM me for a price list for Biotech Labs and 10% discount)

thanks for bumping brother because this is a topic that ALWAYS deserves attention...
 

RickRock

Community Leader
VIP Moderator
thanks for bumping brother because this is a topic that ALWAYS deserves attention...

Yes it is, and many are actually unaware of it and the effects it has on your cycles. It's important to understand myostatin and how it works to properly setup a good cycle to get the most out of it


(PM me for a price list for Biotech Labs and 10% discount)
 

buen

Banned
Thanks Rick... Great info!

Something a really didn't consider when debating which ester to use
Short esters ramp up sooner but the gradual build up provided by longer esters
may keep the myostatin from peaking out sooner as well
 

BigScuds

Member
Member
This is a fantastic thread and really helped answer a few questions I had in regards to gaining size vs gaining strength. As a powerlifter, I'm not too concerned with building new size but very much so about strength. I know other lifters who cruise at dosages that most people blast on and they continue to get stronger. This thread explained how that's possible. Well done RickRock and others. Thank you!
 

stretch512

Member
Cruise 4-6 weeks and I'm g2g. Been cruising though since last September. Actually really enjoying this more than a blast.
 
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